sump plug nigntmare!

[H48HPE]

on monday im taking my car for tuning at my local rover place, to save myself some money I decided id service it myself before it went in. I took the sump plug out to drain the old oil, then when it was empty I put it back in, i screwed it all the way in tightening it with the spanner, but it wouldnt tighten up, so ive obviously stripped the threads now I cant tighten it up or take it out it just sits where it is. Ive filled it back up with oil and its not dripping out. the sump plug is a tight fit so I cant turn it with my hand but noow im nackered cos i dont want to drive it long distances and I cant drain the oil.

Has this happened to anyone else and what did you do???

how involved is putting a new sump on?


Any help most appreciated

Andy

[Mat_C]

If you have enough of a gap, try to lever it out whilst turning it to see if it will 'catch'. You could drill it out and re-tap but its probably easier to change the sump - which is easy as pie, just undo all the bolts at the top (and filler if you have it). Get a new gasket, clean both surfaces up and re-assemble.

Once I had the new sump, I'll drill/punch a hole to get the oil out.

HTH, Mat.

[E_T_V]

Or if you can't get a new sump you could helicoil the old one to repair the thread. Works a treat. Easy job so don't fret. The same happened to me with spark plugs in an alloy head.

[H48HPE]

what does helicoil mean/involve

andy

[E_T_V]

Basically instead of drilling out the hole to a larger size and fitting a bigger bolt, they insert a small spiral of metal into the whole and that acts as a thread. It is a bit more complex than that but not much. It should cost less than 20quid too.

Of course if you are lucky it is just the threads on the sump plug that are stripped in which case a new plug is all that is needed. Try a replacement first as they are cheap and quick to fix.

[H48HPE]

i hope its the plug, do u think motor factors have them in stock?

Do u by any chance know the type of thread and size of the plug? a long shot i know.

Andy

[E_T_V]

A good one is bound to have one in stock, he'll probably have a book listing all the applications too, but I'm sure someone will be along in a minute to give you the exact size just incase.

[e692wtt]

A helicoil sounds like a bodge, but it is 100% ok for stripped threads for bolts (or spark plugs) that are only occasionally undone. If you're lucky, your engineer will be able to do the job in situ . Not recommended for threads that are regularly used, they're not 100% reliable if used too often.

My mate owns a bike shop and he can put a helicoil for a stripped spark plug thread in most bike engines without removing the head (eg Kawasaki GT750 - he used to despatch-ride one and the shop could do this in 10 minutes, before he bought the shop...). Less than £20, job done.

The other other Rich.:)

[John]

I replaced mine with a pipe fitting plug which was easy because I had a plug and tap, still had to take the sump off to get the original bolt out. If I've still got them I could send them to you if you want.

[H48HPE]

got my car to rover this morning and its a big improvement im sure. i asked them to sort the sump plug but the message didn't get through to the mechanics so it didn't get done.

Im taking it to a good back street garage that i know and they are sorting the sump plug out for thirty quid.

Whilst the car was at rover they do a vehicle health check and they came up with the following faults:

both rear wheel cylinders are leaking fluid
front discs are worn out and the pads have uneven wear
handbreak cables are sticking
front and centre sections of exhaust pipe are beginning to blow
corroded rear shocks are weaping oil
would advise sump pan and new gasket
fuel pump gasket weaping
timing cover gasket leaking

all the above work comes to roughly 700 quid to put right. I definitely wont be getting rover to do it though. front discs definitely need to be done though.if a normal garage does the work i expect they would charge a lot less.andy

[E_T_V]

Depending on how competant you feel you are most of those faults are easy fixes which you could DIY.

1. both rear wheel cylinders are leaking fluid - Usually about a tenner each and easily fitted.

2. front discs are worn out and the pads have uneven wear. Discs I've never done but don't believe rover get them measured for yourself. ours had had a hard life and at over 110k they still have plenty of life in them. As for pads usually about 15 quid, again a simple job to fit. The uneven wear will be a sticking caliper which is usually easy to free up.

3. handbreak cables are sticking. Quite a common fault but again make sure rover aren't pulling your leg.

4. Front and centre sections of exhaust pipe are beginning to blow. If it isn't noisy, don't worry about it till the next MOT!

5.corroded rear shocks are weaping oil - Again I;m not sure about rover pulling your leg as ours aren't corroded or leaking at 110k. Worth getting a new set if you've got over 80k on the clock though as mine are knackered. Someone on e-bay was doing them cheap I remember. 20quid a pair I seem to recall. Never done shocks before but I guess I'll be learning soon on ours.

6. would advise sump pan and new gasket - That'll get sorted out at the local garage I presume as you mentioned. If it isn't leaving patches of oil in the driveway then don't worry.

7. fuel pump gasket weaping. Get a new one and fit it. 10 minute job if the pump is accessible.

8. timing cover gasket leaking. They all do that sir.. seriously a lot do. Depends which engine it is but probably a simple enough job too.

If you do the work yourself it'll probably cost you a tenth of the rover quoted price, and you'll learn much more about your car. If you don't feel confident doing it I'm sure there will be some offers of advice and supervision from the group if you need it.
Sorry if it appears I have a downer on Rover dealers too, but in my experience they simply are incompetant, my old local one was anyway.

[e692wtt]

My local motor factors charge less than a fiver for a handbrake cable... food for thought there. Easy-ish to fit, more fiddly and dirty than genuinely difficult.

Front Discs are fiddly and you may need to get physical with a hammer, but it's a case of time and patience rather than difficult. I had to drill out the retaining screws on my Monty's discs.

If in doubt, find a good local garage (they do exist!). Shop around for your own parts though, the garage will charge a 'trade price plus their own comission'.

The other other Rich.:cool:

[MaestroMatt]

I agree with what E_T_V has said but here's my ten pence worth...


both rear wheel cylinders are leaking fluid

I would bet good money that they are fine. Quik Fit said mine were leaking and when I got the covers off the drums to have a look (something Quik Fit clearly hadn't done judging by the way they were rusted on, the cylinders were - unsurprisingly - fine. Get it up on an axle stand and get a rear wheel off. If the drum doesn't undo quite easily (i.e. it doesn't make you swear and curse and run for the WD40 and a hammer) then you can bet they haven't even looked at the cylinders. If you find they are actually leaking, I have a couple of brand new Lucas ones I can sell you.

front discs are worn out and the pads have uneven wear
Easy fix. Pads are about £15 and discs about £20/pair and both are easy to fit but be warned - the discs may put up a fight before they come off. If you need to replace the callipers (which you probably won't) then Lucas do brand new ones for about £25 each.

handbreak cables are sticking
A new cable is, as Rich says, pretty easy to fit and very cheap. The Haynes manual covers it.

front and centre sections of exhaust pipe are beginning to blow
I would be tempted to bodge this for the time being. I have successfully fixed piping with a beer can and a couple of jubilee clips, joints can be fixed with a liberal daubing of fire putty, and silencers can be fixed with special bandage none of which will cost more than a couple of quid. When the repairs to the first bodges fail, it is time to get a new exhaust!

corroded rear shocks are weaping oil
Maestro shocks are pretty cheap but fitting may be expensive. Check that the oil on the shocks wasn't just some engine oil put there by Rover. Wipe them dry and see if more oil materialises.

would advise sump pan and new gasket
Not done this myself, but I have heard it is a fairly simple bolt-off bolt-on job.

fuel pump gasket weaping
A gasket should cost next to nothing and be easy to fit.

timing cover gasket leaking
Not sure about this one as I have never done it, but it is probably not too hard.

I reckon £100 should pretty much cover the lot.

[H48HPE]

my local rover garage seems ok as far as parts go but service is too expensive, also id rather be able to talk to the mechanics about what they are going to do. I agree that I would be better off doing most of the work myself. £700 was silly money.

the most difficult thing ive done so far is to change the water pump, i did a good job on that and it hasn't broken or leaked, so perhaps I should try my hand at more adventurus stuff.


I want to get my car back to mint condition, which will mean spending money I havnt saved up yet. local scum ruined my drivers door breaking into it a couple of months ago, I need a new rear arch and sill, and a new back door because of rust. also other bits and pieces need doing. i wont rest till its all done.

body work sounds expensive though which is never a good thing
:mad:

andy

[John]

If you've done a water pump you should be OK with all those jobs but first check they are all real faults. I've had lots of faults spotted every time I get a tyre but strangely the car keeps passing the MOT.

[Maria]

Slightly off topic, but my sister in her infinite wisdom decided a while back to get rid of the family's trusty Maestro (I have it now!) and buy a Fiat Punto :rolleyes:

It's just cost her £200 for a service and a further £200 to have the tappets done :laugh:

[H48HPE]

That garage I went to today couldnt move the plug so they suggested I get a second hand sump and bring it back for them to fit. the car was still holding its oil in so I drove round to 4 big scrappers and no one could help(two references to rocking horse s*** were made at two of the yards) Im not having the garage fit it though because as already pointed out above it looks like it might be within my capabilities to do it myself. anyway as a short term fix in going to thoughrily de grease the area around the plug, rough up the metal and put epoxy resin over it to make sure the plug stays where it is. im goin searching round more yards tomorrow, I might see somethin else I want whilst im looking. I recon it will cost about 10 to 15 quid so that wont break the bank.

I know its been mentioned before but getting spare parts for these cars when you want them is becoming quite a problem. scrap yards rarely have them in. Its not so bad for diesel versions because most later cars were diesel, but for petrol versions its harder. we need to start stockpiling parts whilst they are still availabe its such a waste for good parts to be crushed .

Andy

[E_T_V]

If you never want the plug to come out again get someone to put a blob of weld to stop it moving. I'm suprised that they couldn't move it though as usually a stripped bolt is really easy to move. What engine is the sump for? Someone might be able to help with one..

[H48HPE]

its a 1.3 I actually dont mind visiting scrap yards though because when ever I need one thing I always get more things than I need, that way Im building up a small but usefull collection of bits(when I manage to find one). you never know, one day one of us might stumble upon somethin really rare and save it from the crusher, i.e one of those prototype cars or somethin like that.

[John]

My stripped plug was impossible to remove from the outside, it just turned without going any where but never leaked! I removed the sump to get it out but don't remember how. If you weld the bolt in why not drill and tap a thread through it and use an ordinary screw with a fibre washer?

[tony]

rear shocks,if they are the same as the montego ,very easy to to ,one bolt at the top one at the bottom the front allmost as easy one bolt at the top and two at the bottom

[E_T_V]

The difficult bit is getting the bolts out!
Then you'll need a spring compressor so you can dismantle them from the springs and replace them. Don't attempt the job unless you beg, borrow, steal, hire a good spring compressor as otherwise you might get hurt as they are under a lot of tension.
If the bolts come out it is an easy job though. One which I've got to get round to myself. If you do do the rears do the fronts at the same time and marvel at how it then drives like it is on rails!

[H48HPE]

just an update, ive managed to get a replacement sump, £45 including delivery from maestro parts and salvage near birmingham, and a new gasket, a fiver from rover. i couldnt get one locally so i had to go for the pricey option. anyway, ive got it now so its just got to be fitted.

andy

[BIGLAD]

Hi,
I didnt notice what engine size your Maestro was. If its a non turbo diesel or 1300 petrol i have one if you ever need another.
As for replacing the rear shocks, you don't need a spring compressor at all. The rear shocks aren't under a great deal off pressure , as you undo the top nut they just "boing" gentlty apart. The biggest headache maybe getting the lower bolt out of the rear beam if the bolt has seized in the shock absorber bush!:)
Biglad