Can I fit a Cat?

[secubis3]

I've just put 146in for a pre mot. She failed on ommissions. I've also been told I need to change my cat and a Lambada???sensor.

My questions are this.

1. Can I change the cat myself?
2. What is a Lambada sensor? and will it need changing?
3. Will I still need a grease monkey to adjust the ommissions?
4. Is it safe for me to do the cat myself?

I have got a cat price down to £45.59 delivered but not fitted. It says it comes with a 2 year garauntee..is this good?

Cheers
S

[oseerees]

Have fitted both on cars. It's a Lambda sensor (measures the proportion of oxygen in the gases, so sometimes known as an Oxygen sensor) usually screws into down pipe and wire/lead plugs in at other end.

Cat is usually not too hard to fit, no more difficult than fitting any exhaust silencer, except bolts on either end instead of clamping (I call them glorified silencers;).

However, I would have it (them) checked elsewhere first to make sure they are faulty. How many miles has the cat done? Ones I have changed have done in excess of 30-40,000 miles. In fact, one Mondeo I had now sold still has the same cat after 100,000 miles. I was told it was faulty at 85,000 because it was rattling like a tin can (part of inside breaking up). Then just before it's MOT it quietened. It passed!! And despite buying a new cat (still in my garage) the old one keeps going with its new owner.:D

[guussi]

you need to buy a large spanner to take that sensor off can be well ensconced
everything else a piece of gyspies kiss...replace with copper grease round the threads for next time ;)

[Ricky]

Waaaaaaait a sec, Lambda sensor? On a Maestro? Are you absolutely sure?

[secubis3]

The car has only done 46608 miles. They said my co was 10.89 and hc was 453. I asked if a tune up would do it but the said the cat was dead and the Lambada was 0.852.

Is this a cat change or a con????

I'll photostat the fail shhet and see what you think.

[secubis3]

the aformentioned cert.

[Ricky]

I assume it does actually have a cat? That reading is ridiculously high though, with figures like that I would have thought you would be going through fuel pretty quickly, the limits for my R reg 600 (according to the emissions test) are less than .30% on the CO, less than 200 on the HC, and a lambda reading between .970 and 1.030 at between 2500-3000 rpm - I'd think they would be different for your car, but I could be wrong, someone will be along to correct me in a second, no doubt! I'm 95% certain you haven't got a lambda sensor though, I would have thought the cost of equipping the Maestro with such fancy gadgets would have made them pull the plug on the car sooner if that were the case! And why is it down as a Metro?

[Russ]

That sheet says metro rover 100?

[Russ]

Just read your sheet again, assuming there is actually a cat fitted the last thing you want to do is fit a new one without reducing the mixture on the carb, as with that CO reading it would probably wreck a new cat within a very short time

[secubis3]

When they do this test do they have a specific set of limits for each car or are they all the same?

If so then they have got it far wrong!!!!!!!!

[Russ]

All cars have to meet a specific CO reading for th age of the vehicle, not sure what it is for yours. By rights if your car is L reg IIRC a check has to be made to see if the Cat is actualy fitted but at that age I dont think the performance of the cat is tested. Im not sure of the CO figures for that age , but im pretty sure by turning the mixture down you may get your car through the test. You have to remember that the chap doing the test probably doesnt realise that older cars can have their CO altered by screws and not a laptop or ecu change!

[Ricky]

Ah, wait a sec - the Metro would have a lambda sensor etc, but the Maestro does not - it says there on the sheet about a closed loop system, which I'm not sure is what the Maestro has, but having never owned a petrol car with a cat (until now), I can't say for sure... But that might affect it, if Maestro was not an option he would have done better to tell the system that the car is a Mini of similar vintage rather than a Metro, though! I'm sure this has been discussed a long time ago on here, I seem to remember someone else on here having a very similar issue many moons ago.

[Russ]

It says 1275 metro on that sheet, cats were fitted to some A series metros which I assume were simmilar to the non injection minis which also did not have a lamda sensor

[threelitre]

First it needs to be made sure if the car has a lambda sensor at all - this makes a major difference regarding the procedures to follow.

Case 1) If it is an A-series car with a carb, then there should be no lambda sensor fitted and it probably needs only an adjustment to the carb (or a new one if the carb is worn). With such a rich mixture there is no chance to even see if the cat is working. If you are able to get the mixture right (Lambda=1.0), CO should be below 1% on a good condition engine (good ignition system, good compression). If run with this mixture until the cat has warmed up, there will be a noticeable dip in CO content - down to 0.1% is quite normal when the cat is working. So first thing would be to get the mixture set absolutly spot on and then check if the cat is working by seeing CO dip under 0.5%. If the mixture is only slightly out, the cat will not be able to work properly and CO will not be within regulations (with Lambda=0.9 you can expect up to 4% CO). Check the airfilter before starting to adjust ignition first and then the mixture.

Case 2) If it is a fuel injected Metro with a closed loop system, then the first stop would be to use some diagnostic equipment to check the inputs of the ECU. I can think of 3 typical errors causing such a rich mixture: The coolant temperature sensor for the ECU (different to the one driving the instrument), the air-temperature sensor and the lambda sensor. I'd check the temp-sensors first.

Hope this helps!

Regards,

Alexander

[Chris Y]

Your car may possibly have a Lambada (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lambada) sensor for detecting the onset of Latin-American dancing, but I doubt it has a Lambda (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lambda) (oxygen) sensor (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oxygen_sensor) :D

It sounds like the garage have just plain screwed up the procedure.

[secubis3]

Got it sorted and through the MOT.

My cat does not have a Lambda as the hole is blanked off!!!
Although it has a cat, it is not tested as L146 was manufactured before 92 even though the reg is 93.

How the prat of a mechanic did not notice a lambada-less cat is beyond me????

My new best friend at the local garage spotted this right away: he's an old boy and got my ommissions down to 1.7% just by giving the engine an additive and a good blast. So now I've found a competant machanic who does not need a laptop to know what is wrong, I'm a much happier chappie.

Thanks every one for your help and advice

Cheers
S

[secubis3]

I spoke with the guy at the garage and he said that he could not find my car on his machine and put it through as a Rover with a 1.3 engine!!!
I contacted VOSA and they said it should have been tested as an ordinary exhaust as it has no senors attached, this should be picked up as they should first check the cat type before testing, and £260 for repairs was well in excess of acceptable figures (YEAH...£240 in excess)

Complaint to be put in writing then they will investigate.

[e692wtt]

Blimey! Tester clearly having a very bad day... VOSA won't be impressed with the garage's behaviour.